One last note about CONvergence - Jay Maynard

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Sunday, 18 July 2004


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0254 - One last note about CONvergence

I'm told that the subject of my having a picture to hand out came up by way of a derisive comment at the postmortem. So much for the whole thing blowing over...between that, and raptavio and his homeyz deciding that accusing me of "lur[ing] kids into vans with candy" in his standup routine would be funny, I really, really don't feel welcome in Twin Cities SF fandom right now.

current mood: [mood icon] irritated

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Comments:


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From:evilzug
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those who matter, don't mind.
those who mind, don't matter.
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From:howardtayler
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Oh, look! A clever quip taken out of its original context.

Dude, you need to take that thing back to the game preserve. It won't survive as a pet, and I don't think you know how to take care of it.

--Howard
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From:evilzug
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INTERNET FIGHT
From:jmaynard
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From:deadly_touch
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Ugh. I am sorry people suck!
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From:rillaspins
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CONvergence

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I am very disappointed in a few of the Concom and the CONvergence board. After years of hearing snarky remarks about my friends, they have decided that my reporting and discussing a man I find dangerous and scary is a liability to the convention. Fairness only seems to apply to them and their friend. I can just go rot. I will just have to wait until someone important to them gets bothered or hurt by this man. Don't worry Jay, you are in good company, I have heard more and more of these comments. I have just been living in the land of denial and defending people who don't care about anyone but like to put up a face of "diversity" and give lip service to being open to all types of people. Bitter--me?
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From:ethel
Date: - 0000
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For the record, the person who made that comment was me. The subject of freebies being handed out came up, and I brought you and your photos up. Half of it was snarky; I've said publically here in your journal to you that I find it hypocritical that you seem to attention grab with one hand and then vehemently push it away with the other. Yes, that seems weird and kooky and well, off to me and I've never made a secret of it. But the other half was just goofing off and having a bit of fun.

I've also treated you with respect here. I may not agree with you, which I've also never made a secret of, but I've treated you with respect.

We joke around in concomm meetings...a lot. I don't think a single meeting goes by where we don't pick on one gal for being short (she is) or on another member of the board for being...well, we just pick on him. The board teased one of the heads of Cinema Rex on Saturday for not having a budget (a few years ago Cinema Rex teased the board or something like that and the board responded in print "wait till they see their budget next year"...as a joke.) We teased one of the co-heads of Consuite as well.

I didn't think of my comment as any different than the regular ribbing (hey, I get it too), and I am sorry it got interpreted that way. If I had known, I would have kept my mouth shut.

Also, I'm not sure what exactly was different about my comment other than the fact that I said it in a room where you weren't present instead of in your lj, but it was nothing I haven't said here. Why was that different? I don't know, but I'm sorry it caused trouble.

And for the record, at the meeting, I also passed on very high praise from one of my friends who is a single mom with two boys who loved the project room and who had specifically asked me to seek out rillaspins to pass along her thanks for a job well-done. I saw her later Saturday night and she was very upset that she is leaving concomm...according to her, rillaspins is what makes the project room, and she will be missed. Not just by my friend, but by me and I'm sure several others as well. I don't know what the circumstances behind her leaving are, but I'm sad to see her go.

Sigh.
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From:jmaynard
Date: - 0000
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Sometimes, what's a bit of fun to some folks is nothing but hurt to others. Indeed, that's the basis of my whole discussion about mocking and trolling.

Yes, you, unlike my real detractors, have treated me with respect. Don't think it has gone unnoticed or unappreciated.

Hearing about the comment made me sigh in resignation because I thought it was just another slam aimed in my direction for something that I thought had blown over - and this one behind my back. People keep saying "don't worry about, nobody will hold it against you in the future"...and every time I start to believe it, someone else brings it back up. I am really having a hard time believing that anyone will ever take me seriously at CONvergence ever again, right now.

I can't speak directly to rillaspins's reason for leaving. I suggest you read her LJ, and decide for yourself - or here's a novel idea: ask her. I can say that, from what I've read and been told, in her shoes, I'd raise holy hell on the way out, and maybe even file criminal charges. I can also say that defending the guy she's concerned about, and yet taking the kind of shots at me that people have taken, is hypocritical in the extreme, and speaks very poorly for Twin Cities SF fandom.
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From:ethel
Date: - 0000
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Yeah, I just read it. Quite scary really...I had no idea. Registration is not allowed to give out registration status for any person because of privacy issues. Talking with the con is the next step. This is not my department (mine is web -- I head up the website) but if it were it would have ended there with a blacklist. The next step would probably be to get a restraining order. If he's stalking that many women I'd be completely freaked out as well.

Please remember that the concomm is around 100 people big. It's a huge, volunteer-driven organization with its own departments. We certainly don't all think with a hive mind.

(oh, and I have never met raptavio. To my knowledge, he's not associated with running cvg at all.)

Now that that's out of the way, I hope you're resting even slightly easier now that you know more of what went on behind that derisive comment. I make a point of not filtering my livejournal (except in terms of personal contact info or friends-only party invites) because I don't like the idea of hiding what you're saying behind groups and friends filters. If you believe it enough to say it, you should believe it enough to stand behind it, or shut your fool mouth. I try very hard not to say anything that I wouldn't say in front of 50 close friends and 50 complete strangers, both online and in rl.

As I said, I'm not sorry for my standpoint on you, your photos, or your guest appearances, but I am sorry that I opened my mouth at the meeting. (It was only in a small group of 10 or so people -- not the entire concomm, btw.) If I had known, I would have indeed kept my mouth shut.
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From:jmaynard
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I only post things to my LJ that I'm comfortable with the whole world knowing (aside from a couple of entries that I'd prefer not to get back to my employer, which are friends-only). Similarly, I don't post anonymously, ever, for I feel that one should have enough of the courage of one's convictions to stand behind one's words.

I don't mind your disagreement with what I say. Reasonable people can have reasonable differences of opinion.

raptavio may not be involved with CONvergence; if not, that's a point in favor of the con. rillaspins may find a niche at Marscon (and yes, folks, I know they're separate organizations; no need to keep reminding me), but if she does, I will not follow her there because of raptavio's position of leadership there. (Aside: Why is it that I can find no information whatsoever about the Marscon committee at their website?)
From:ethel
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From:jmaynard
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From:ethel
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From:jmaynard
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From:ethel
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From:jmaynard
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From:mesmericone
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From:mesmericone
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From:jmaynard
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From:433
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Well, it's tough, because we can't speak publically about it, so we can't defend ourselves.

What we have here is an accusation with no proof. The law doesn't work that way, and neither can we. If we banned someone because of someone else's unsubstantiated claim against them, we could easily open ourselves up to legal action.

Yes another "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.
From:jmaynard
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From:433
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From:jmaynard
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From:433
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From:jmaynard
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From:433
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From:jmaynard
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From:mesmericone
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All I am saying that just cause a few people said whatever doesn't mean that they stand for the entire Twin Cities Fandom community. You are generalizing.....
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From:jmaynard
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I understand your point. Unfortunately, right now, I have only that small number of experiences to go on, and can't help but generalize from them, especially when deciding whether to associate myself further with that community.
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From:mso
Date: - 0000
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I'm flattered that you would go so far as to take my quote out of context.

LOOKS LIKE. LOOKS LIKE.

Plus I don't think I have any standing in "SF fandom."
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From:jmaynard
Date: - 0000
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Do you think anyone listening to the routine would hear those words before deciding I'm a child molester? I don't. "Looks like" are mild words that get lost behind the hand grenade of "child molester".

You, personally, may not have any standing...but that trollboy got such support from his homeyz says that he does represent some significant number of folks within that community.
[User Picture]
From:mso
Date: - 0000
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No one listens to his routines anyway.

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