Sunday, 4 July 2004
I'm not going to spend the time it would take to refute your argument point-by-point. You're not worth it. However, I will say that mockers and trolls are nearly as destructive on the net as spammers: they destroy meaningful communication by being deliberately hurtful. You may think you're not hurting anyone who doesn't allow themselves to be hurt, but you're flat-out wrong.
I didn't do anything to rate the treatment I got from the Slashdot and Fark denizens. I shared my work, and got a huge ration of grief for it. Yes, I am a victim of that, and nothing you can say will change that.
And you know what, you can believe that. Hell, your only crime was being too dumb to know what the result of posting your cameltoe self would be.
This does not in any way justify your behavior at the panel, your rage at the Saturday morning panel, or your aggressive attacks on the panelists in your LJ. and you have thus far failed to admit any wrongdoing other than letting an offhand remark at the LJ panel get to you as much as it did.
I'll even give you a miss for your repeated attacks upon me, after all, I'm being pretty confrontational with you too. I wonder if you consider yourself my victim... hmm!
As for your position about mockers and trolls... eh. Intelligent people have the right to disagree. They just shouldn't disrupt entire panels in so doing.
I've already said that I let the comments at the panel get to me more than I should have. As for feeling rage at Saturday morning, I'm not going to apologize for it. I was ready to put Friday night behind me, but apparently nobody else was. (Yes, I should have made the attempt at a peace offering. I have no clue as to whether or not it would have been accepted. I didn't know that same moderator was on the Saturday morning panel until I walked in, shortly after the panel started - which I think even you will admit was not the time to be pulling her aside for a peace offering.)
What you term attacks on the panelists in my LJ was no such thing. I specifically did not mention anyone's name because I did not wish to attack them, only what went on. There's a difference.
I disagree with you on that. Everyone who was at the panel and many who weren't knew exactly who you were referring to. This is a small fandom, and we know each other.
I also disagree with you about the rage thing. It was, as you admit it was on Friday, very inappropriate. Being ignored on Saturday was an entirely appropriate consequence for your actions on Friday, and you should accept that.
Everyone who was at the panel and many who weren't knew exactly who you were referring to. This is a small fandom, and we know each other.
And how am I, a newcomer, supposed to know that? 2000 people at a con is, to me, a large crowd, not a small fandom.
If you feel that being ignored was an appropriate consequence for my actions on Friday, then you've confirmed that I have no need to appear at any further Twin Cities cons...for, by that standard, there's no reason to expect that I will ever not be ignored.
There again you are wrong. Peace offerings and apologies are very routinely accepted in the fandom. But they must be made to be accepted.
I expect you'll withdraw anyway, that seems to be your way. You seem to have a long history of entering a fandom and quickly leaving. I wonder if you'll ever question that the problem lies with you, and not all those fandoms.
Oh, I do have a long history, eh? For someone who only ever heard of me a week ago, you know one hell of a lot about me.
...and what you claim to know is wrong. No, I don't have a long history of backing out of fandoms. Just ask the folks who I had dinner with last night about that. They flew and drove up from Texas, and I drove up from Fairmont, to have dinner together. (Not solely, in their case, but we did make an effort to get together.) We've all known each other for more than 25 years, and have worked together in several related areas in that time. The same goes for more than a few other things I've been involved with.
In fact, I went to CONvergence fully expecting to find yet another group to spend too much time with. I was sadly disappointed. At this point, any group with which you are as closely associated as Twin Cities SF fandom appears to be is a group I want nothing to do with.
Oh, and I forgot, I'm really, really not surprised you wouldn't go after my argument point by point. To acknowledge some of it would be to admit error on your part, and you just couldn't bring yourself to do that now could you.
I've got better things to do with my time than spend an hour hand-crafting a reply to a troll.
Gosh, and I did that in 20 minutes.
I see you pigeonholed me as nothing more a troll. It's nice to do that to people who say things you don't like, because that way you don't have to consider if what they're saying has any truth to it.
By definition, a troll's arguments are not connected to what he believes. If you don't believe what you're saying, why should I take it seriously? How do I know you're not simply trolling me now?
I didn't pigeonhole you as nothing more than a troll. You did it yourself, by not only admitting it, but bragging about it.
Sure I'm a troll. But I'm also a father, a comic, a computer geek, a scifi fan.
I'm not telling you what I don't believe. I'm more approaching this from the perspective that I'll tell you the unvarnished truth and you'll remain impervious to it.
The unvarnished truth as you perceive it. As you have no doubt realized, I disagree with it.
I only hope you're not raising your kids to think that mocking and trolling is acceptable...for if you are, you're merely inflicting your damage on the next generation.
I'm raising my children to be honest people, to tell the truth, rather than to lie and accept crap from others.
I'm also trying to teach them appropriate ways to deal with conflict so that they don't end up like you.
Since you appear to believe trolling and mocking are appropriate ways to deal with conflict, I fear you are, indeed, inflicting your philosophy indirectly on future generations, and I'm sorry for your kids and those who they will victimize.